The RM Podcast: The Do’s and Don'ts of Scaling Your Talent Team

Symphony Talent
May 3 ․ 57 min read

Talent acquisition has been through the wringer over these past few years. As talent professionals, we’ve had to shift to meet the new demands of our employees, candidates and customers.

For many of us, that meant rapidly growing our internal talent teams

It’s been a lot, but it’s yielded some fantastic leaps and bounds in an otherwise slow to change industry. 

Debbie Tuel chats with Adam Miller, Director, Talent Acquisition, Quantum Health, on agile recruitment and his knowledge of scaling recruitment teams from 20 to 120 to meet those market demands. 

In this RM Podcast episode, you’ll discover tips from a been there, done that practitioner on:

  • Takeaways from growing a talent acquisition team: what worked (and what didn’t)  
  • Tips on how to meet your talent goals and support your Center of Excellence 
  • Insights on how to pivot from traditional talent acquisition to brand sourcing

So dive in and check out our top tips, and don't forget to subscribe. 

 

Debbie Tuel:

Hi, everyone. Welcome to The RM Podcast. I'm your host Debbie Tuel, and I hope that you are ready for an all new lineup of experts who are itching to step out of the parameters of traditional recruitment and talent acquisition speak and get real on what it means to recruit on a worker economy and quite frankly, an upside down world. Let's dig in together. Talent acquisition has been through the ringer over these past few years. As talent professionals, we've had to shift to meet new demands of our employers, candidates, and customers. And for many of us that's meant at first coming to an abrupt halt and then almost as abruptly, turning in the opposite direction and rapidly growing our internal talent teams to support the company's external growth.

Debbie Tuel:

It's been a lot, but it's also yielded us some fantastic leaps and bounds in an otherwise slow to change industry. Today, I get to chat with Adam Miller, who's seen this type of rapid growth firsthand. Will dig into agile recruitment and what he's learned in scaling recruitment teams from 20 to 120 to meet those market demands. Listen in to learn tips from practitioner who's been there and done that and now ready to do it all again. Adam, welcome to The RM Podcast. How are you?

Adam Miller:

Hey, thank you so much for the kind welcome and the awesome setup that I probably didn't deserve, but I really appreciate. Yeah, I'm thrilled to be here.

Debbie Tuel:

Well, we got to know you Adam here at Symphony Talent through your work at Safelite. I'd love to take a step back in the looking glass to a couple of years ago and the start of the pandemic hits and you like so many were impacted by the pandemic. Share with our listeners, what happened at Safelite? What happened to you and your career path when the pandemic hit?

Adam Miller:

Yeah, thanks for that. I had joined Safelite in February 2020, which was right before the world fell apart. I think my first day might have been March 1st or March 3rd, technically, but I'd signed the offer letter in February. Things were going great. I had changed out of a large national healthcare provider and it was just time for me to make a move at that time. I had stood up a sourcing and brand team of my previous employer. I had a couple of connections at Safelite that sourced and brought me over to build a similar program at Safelite. I was really stoked to do it because large consumer brand that everybody knows. And then two weeks in the world fell apart, the world collapsed, right? COVID hits. We started hearing about this thing called Corona over and over again.

Adam Miller:

There were a lot of puns, there were a lot of gifs, and then we all got sent home temporarily. It was two weeks to stop the spread and that quickly changed to two more weeks, to two more weeks, to two more months. Week two, I was sent home from my job as the manager of brand and sourcing for Safelite, and week four, I was furloughed along with countless others. That's not a slight against Safelite, that's not a woe is me story. That was a story echoed by hundreds, if not hundreds of thousands, if not more across the country and certainly across the globe. It was a couple of month hiatus for me. I actually picked up some consulting while I was off, but when I came back, my job changed entirely and I'm sure we'll get into that. But that was how I started and it was a brief few weeks in that role and that job title before everything changed.

Debbie Tuel:

Well, I bring this up and I kick us off with that because it's so relatable to so many of our listeners who experienced the same thing. I think there's two things that they can learn from this is one, that you were agile and said, "Hey, I don't have to just sit here during this break. I'm going to actually pick up some work during this time and stretch that consulting muscle and see what else I can do." But two, there was the light at the end of the tunnel for many of us that were furloughed or had to take pay cuts. I said it during our intro, right? The businesses rebounded and all of a sudden people had to come back to work and oftentimes, we were asked to do more with less. Whatever that reasoning be, whether the business had changed, the people had changed, all of a sudden what we were doing in the past wasn't necessarily the future.

Debbie Tuel:

Tell me, when you came back, you said the job changed, what did it change into? You come from the branding side of the business, what did it morph into as you came back into the business?

Adam Miller:

Yeah. I would be remiss if I didn't acknowledge that when I first got furloughed, I was pretty salty, right. The brand guy in me was like-

Debbie Tuel:

You mean you weren't celebrating.

Adam Miller:

Right. The brand guy in me was like, "Well, from an employer brand perspective, this isn't the best look." Right. But the other part of me was thinking, It's a shame that all of these TA folks, not only at my business, but across the board had seemingly lost their jobs overnight, as if businesses in the world weren't going to have to recruit when all this settled down. Right. In a lot of ways, not only did my job reset, but everybody across the country that works in our industry's jobs reset because they had to rebuild from the ground up to your point. What worked before didn't work anymore because people weren't ready to go back to work necessarily. They were still getting stimulus checks, they were enjoying time at home, maybe they just reprioritize what was important in life. Throwing an indeed add up, wasn't going to solve the problem anymore, so we had to rethink how recruiting work practically overnight.

Debbie Tuel:

Yeah. If you've been listening to this podcast long enough, you know then for me, that was definitely true. We came back to work and for us at Symphony, we never really had a gap, but my life changed overnight with three young school age boys that were all of a sudden at home. Work becomes a little bit less of a priority when you've got to teach somebody who can't read how to do school on a computer. Right. You're all of a sudden like, "Okay, all the systems that I had in place before to support this lovely work life balances out the window, what's the new balance?" There's so many stories of how work has shifted for everybody. Whatever the situation may be, we come back and we say, "Okay, it's time to look at things in a different lens." And recruiting has been impacted so heavily by that shift. As you guys came back and you said, "Okay, we've got to make the most of this from an employment brand standpoint and a recruiting standpoint." What did that mean for you and the work that you were doing at Safelite?

Adam Miller:

Yeah. When I got the call back, the call actually came from our chief people officer, which was an amazing feeling just to get somebody with the C-suite to give you a personal call on your cell phone and say, "Hey, we hope you want to come back because we're ready for it." But there was a caveat, and the caveat as we'd mentioned or alluded is that my job title was changing and they hoped that I would be okay with that. I of course, was just thrilled to get the call. I of course said, yes, not even seeing a JD or really knowing what my responsibilities were going to be. My title became manager or senior manager or something of TA strategy and operations, which was effectively like a mighty COE of one. Right?

Adam Miller:

When I reviewed that JD, once I was settled into role, it was by the way, you're still doing brand and sourcing, but we also want to take a look at TA scorecards and dashboards and analytics and vendor management and project and program management and maybe we can do some sourcing work on top of it, and by the way, here's TA technology that's a little lacking. I say all that to say, that's the exciting stuff.

Debbie Tuel:

That is a lot of hats, Adam.

Adam Miller:

But it was super cool work and I did get to bring a couple of people on in my first year in that role and slowly built out a team that got to handle each of those subject matter expertise areas, instead of it just being me, trying to do a little bit of everything, which isn't effective, but that's what the role morphed into.

Debbie Tuel:

As you stepped into this role and you said, "Okay, I'm going to build out a center of excellence, meaning I am the center of excellence, and we're going to take a look at reporting and dashboards and vendor relationships and TA tech." How did you determine where you were going to put the focus first? Because that's a lot. How do you determine where do we start?

Adam Miller:

Yeah, I'd be remiss if I said that I wasn't, or didn't acknowledge that I wasn't overwhelmed. I definitely was. I think I have a wishlist in my head because I've come from a large company that had 130, some odd thousand employees. While budgets weren't a thing, we certainly had the bells and whistles, right. We had a best in class ATS. We had all these cool engagement tools that really made your job as a recruiter easy and then fast forward to Safelite, we were on ADP, which was... Nothing against ADP as a tool, it just hadn't been cared for over the years, and recruiting had only recently centralized. It made no sense for us to go all in with the latest and greatest tech and build out all the super modern things, because we didn't have the bones of a program yet.

Adam Miller:

What was most important was to stand up a minimally viable approach to a lot of things. Dashboards were really just dressed up Excel sheets for a while. KPIs were tracked literally manually in Excel by recruiters, and then we would analyze them and pivot tables and stuff like that. That's not sustainable, but we got the bones of what we needed for a while. Vendor relationships were not even on a calendared schedule, so we just tore those all to shreds and started from the ground up, renegotiated terms, renegotiated timelines, because we knew that what we were spending money on now was only going to grow as we built a larger and larger and larger program. In order to get those things done right, let's just start over. At the time, I think we had 20 recruiters and it had just recently centralized, so things were working, but they weren't scaling yet.

Adam Miller:

We were doing things like making, hiring [inaudible 00:09:59] surveys in Microsoft Forms. We didn't buy tools or tech for any of this stuff, we just figured out, how can we gather data? How can we interpret data? And then what's the light at the end of the tunnel for three years from now?

Debbie Tuel:

Yeah. For those that are listening, we had a very similar conversation with Julia Levy, a couple of months back. What I love about these real in-person stories is most TA professionals don't have unlimited budgets. While we all see in conferences and so forth leaders getting up and talking about all these amazing things that they're doing and the tools that they've invested in and the tech they've invested in. They've usually had to prove out the business case without that budget in the early days, and be scrappy, figure out, what tools do we have to make this work? Let's prove out that it does work and then we can go and fight for the budget to maybe make it better or make it to where it can scale. It sounds like that's exactly the work that you were doing at Safelite.

Adam Miller:

That is a 100% the work that we were doing. I had the benefit of working with some really talented, intelligent, driven peers who either had the institutional knowledge of having been at Safelite for a long time, or having been in the industry for a long time to cross pollinate these ideas with, this could have never been done on my own. It's entirely too much work. When you're talking about a business case to invest tens of thousands of dollars in new tools and more head count and all these things, that's not happening, unless you know the players at stake who are going to be signing the check at the end of the day. Yeah, we did have to prove out everything bit by bit, and we slowly got approval after approval, but only because of strong relationships internally and from being able to provide value and show that A, this is actually a lot more effective than outsourcing this [inaudible 00:11:52].

Debbie Tuel:

I think what's incredible is you did that in a relatively short amount of time. We're talking about in an 18 month window, you guys grew from 20 to 120 recruiters. Is that right? Am I getting my numbers and my math correct?

Adam Miller:

It sounds nice when I say that because it rolls off the tongue, I think it's technically more around a 100, but yeah, it's somewhere in that ballpark and I'm sure they're still growing.

Debbie Tuel:

It is incredible growth. It is a short timeframe for the work that you were doing. Maybe we can pick one or two of the projects that you're most proud of that you can share with our listeners. You go in, you start doing things slowly, you start proving out the business case. Where did that take you? What are you most proud of in that process?

Adam Miller:

Yeah, I think a couple of them were just role charters that I achieved from my COE specifically, as I mentioned, I was wearing a lot of hats and that wasn't sustainable. Not only was it not sustainable, it just, frankly, wasn't my expertise. I'm a recruiting guy who likes to bring in talent and give a sales pitch and like be flashy and stuff. I don't love compliance, I don't love the other HR backend functions, but there are a lot of people who do, and a lot of people who are really good at it. One of the things that fell under my jurisdiction, if you will, was talent compliance. All things visa related, background checks, preemployment adjudication, all of that, I was able to repurpose a strong internal player and do a fully dedicated compliance role that was able to eventually over time, cross train all of our TA coordinators to share that burden as opposed to having it just be a one person shop.

Adam Miller:

It's one person running your compliance program's fine when you're a couple thousand employees, but when you're quickly going to 16 to 20,000 employees, it doesn't work anymore. I also hired a full-time analyst, I think her title was talent operation specialist, but really she's our data guru, right? Taking those half baked ideas of an Excel dashboard and making it something magical, that's migrating to Tableau as we speak so that people can pull realtime information on, voice of customer results, voice of candidate results, recruiter effectiveness, KPIs, time to offer, all that stuff. That took our operation to the next level seemingly overnight. She had to get scrappy at first, but we're finally at a point where all of that information, all of that tech is enabling our teams to work smarter and just focus on can to interaction as opposed to having to manage all this administrative bloat.

Adam Miller:

The other big one is deploying an ATS. Safelite's managed and owned by a parent company called Belron based out of UK. We were growing, but also our parent company was growing. We centralized, I think, 30 different HCMS and ATSs down to Workday across the global footprint. For the better part of the last year, I was helping build an ATS that was a little bit more modern and a little bit more candidate friendly and a little bit more data friendly as well. Those are the two big ones. And then, now that I've left, they've still got tons of projects in flight. They're enhancing what they're doing with Paradox and chat and SMS. They're looking at career side overlays. There's a lot of cool stuff happening that I'm not the guy taking it across the finish line, but the amount of growth that happened in a short time is incredible.

Debbie Tuel:

Amazing. I think I heard you say that the work that the people analytics guru, if you will, people operations came in to do, the work that she's doing now is going into Tableau. Is that correct?

Adam Miller:

That's right. Yep.

Debbie Tuel:

I just want to double click into that, is that because that's what the business is using for other analytics and so it makes sense to take those people analytics and put it into that? I think that's a big question that we have in talent acquisition is, how do we centralize this and marry this data? I love when I hear that companies are putting big data solutions. Share with me a little bit of insight with our listeners on that decision.

Adam Miller:

Yeah. I'll have to admit when I first was privy to the fact that we wanted to use Tableau, it wasn't necessarily my first choice. I came from another company that used Workday prior to Safelite. I was really jealous that Safelite had chosen not to buy Workday Prism, which is their analytic suite, it's very user friendly, it's native, it's in the same platform, so it's easy to get to as an HR person. But what it doesn't do is it doesn't give that same visibility to the entire business, so hindsight being 2020, I understand why the business wanted to go with Tableau for their HR data. The choice was made because that's what Safelite was choosing to use for all data visualization, all big data needs across the company. Whether that was finance, IT, all of those dashboards are being housed in Tableau. The question became, how do we get data out of Workday and into Tableau? And the answer rests in Snowflake, so that's the data lake that's at play there.

Debbie Tuel:

Amazing. I appreciate you giving us a little bit more insight there. Because I think that is a big looming either gap or a question for a lot of TA professionals. You mentioned, and kind of the elephant, you're not at Safelite anymore. As we were planning today's podcast episode, you were like, "Oh, and by the way, I'm switching jobs." Which is really exciting. We're seeing a ton of that movement right now in the market. What made you decide you've got all this work, you're doing some amazing projects and you decide, "Hey, look, I've seen this scale. I'm ready to make a change." What was that trigger?

Adam Miller:

Yeah, it was a couple things. It was hard, right? It's hard to leave any work family in the moment when you're really excited about an opportunity, you sign the doted line and you're really stoked. And then the day comes that you give your notice and you're like, "Should I?" And I definitely have that because like I said, I love the people I worked with. I got to accomplish a lot of cool things and I was partnering on a lot more cool things, frankly, but for me, the exit came because I'd taken the work that I thought I could accomplish there to its final point in terms of my skillset, my scope, and my experience. Safelite's a rapidly growing organization that ultimately I think in order to get them to the next level, they need a hot shot from a larger company that's been at that level before.

Adam Miller:

That's not downplaying myself, you got to be realistic about what your expectations and capabilities are. And for me, I wanted to step back into a slightly smaller company and try to do another program built with different level. I love the idea of hypergrowth, I love the idea of building, but at a certain point you got to know your limits and I thought that it was the right time to take a different challenge.

Debbie Tuel:

Tell us about this new challenge. You're now at Quantum Health. Tell us a little bit about Quantum Health. What is the work that you guys do, the size of the company, the types of roles that you're recruiting for real quick?

Adam Miller:

Yeah, it's cool. I haven't mastered the sales pitch, but I've been sitting with our recruiters and listening to the ones that are really good at it. Quantum Health is really the player in healthcare navigation in terms of companies who do it as an independent employer. Healthcare navigation exists in insurance providers, it exists in hospital systems, but those healthcare navigation pros are really embedded to help Aetna or help UHG or help insert hospital name. Quantum's mission is to help the clients that they sign on with who might be a, whether it's an employer or a healthcare client of some sort. They exist to really help their patients or their enroll of lives navigate a healthcare journey. What that means is if you were to receive some kind of diagnosis tomorrow, it's going to be overwhelming, right? You're going to look at the back of your benefits card and not know who to call and what to tell them.

Adam Miller:

Quantum's business purpose and their stated goal is to make that journey as seamless as possible for the patient. While we do sign on corporate clients to cover their benefits programs, at the end of the day, we serve the individual that's enrolled in that benefits program. We've got a team of nurses, patient services reps, an entire medical credentialing program that really just helps end users like myself, if I were to receive some kind of diagnosis tomorrow, I don't know which doctor to go to or how, or why. It's complex out there, so I would call Quantum Health and Quantum would take care of scheduling my appointments, getting me my prescriptions. It really just puts a face in a name and a central point of contact to the entire healthcare journey.

Debbie Tuel:

Such a strong mission, but also such a really challenging area to recruit in today. I think I saw a stat that almost 70% of healthcare workers are looking at leaving their jobs, not the greatest field to get into when you're talking about recruiting, but it's obviously where your passion is because it's where you have worked in the past and now we're coming back to, and it sounds like really exciting opportunity. What is the piece of the actual job that has you most excited? What is the work that you're going to be doing that's like, yes, I want to be doing this again?

Adam Miller:

Yeah. I think the first part is the industry. As I mentioned earlier, I worked for a healthcare provider earlier in my career. I loved being around healthcare. Again, hindsight being 2020, I left just at the right time to not be working in healthcare around the peak of COVID, because that would've been pretty stressful. But this is the perfect marriage of both corporate recruiting needs healthcare recruiting. We have a pretty substantial corporate clientele group, which is all business transformation type stuff, a lot of IT, a lot marketing and creative and B2B. There's a huge corporate recruiting component, but there's also a giant clinical and customer service recruiting component. Our bread and butter is what we call the patient service representative skillset, which is basically an elevated CSR. We say that we're not a contact center, but at the end of the day, we're still taking inbound calls from our patients and clients.

Adam Miller:

Those service reps are really the front lines of Quantum Health's mission, so they're a different kind of person. We get a lot of people from hospitality and while it is a volume recruiting business, we're not seeing crazy high turnover because we're hiring people who really care about what they're doing on the phones. There's also a nursing recruiting component, which as you mentioned, a tough sell right now, but it's a really interesting sell and that we're able to find nurses who might have just been burnt out on the floors and on the units throughout the pandemic and might be ready for a different pace of life. But ultimately, outside of industries and verticals and skill sets and all that good stuff, I'm excited because it's a program built, like I mentioned earlier, but it's at a much smaller scale.

Adam Miller:

Hypergrowth for Quantum Health means something different than hypergrowth in a Fortune 500. We're taking a program that's at 10 recruiters or so right now and it might double over the course the next couple years, but it's not going to be 120 or 200 or anything like that. But I'm in a position where I get to help really build the program of my dreams and make sure that it delivers on business goals in every step of the way. Whether that's [inaudible 00:23:03] processes or hiring the right recruiter.

Debbie Tuel:

Yeah. You get to see this idea all the way through, right? I think being at a more agile company, a smaller company gives you that flexibility to start a project and have your hands on it and really see it through to the finish line.

Adam Miller:

If there is a finish line, I don't know if there is, right.

Debbie Tuel:

Moving target.

Adam Miller:

But they've never had a dedicated TA leader either, it's been a combination of a recruiter who was elevated to a recruiting manager, but then they were still outsourcing some of their searches. Again, no shade being thrown at the business at all, they just weren't at the size and scope where they needed a dedicated TA organization. The fact that business results are yielding the need and the necessity for a dedicated team of recruiters and a clinical team versus a corporate team. That's an exciting place to be because that means that the business has grown like crazy, your patients and your consumers are seeing value, now it's time to take it to the next level.

Debbie Tuel:

You've now had a couple of opportunities to learn about scaling through business and recruiting teams and technology and process. What have you learned along the way that you'd say, "You know what? I am going to take this mistake that I made here and apply that to my next role and do it differently." What would be that learning that maybe you could share to ripen others learning curve for them?

Adam Miller:

Yeah, well, as you've probably noticed in the 32 minutes that we've been on this call, I talk a lot and that could be a problem. We're in TA, we're recruiters, we like to hear our own voice, it's a problem. One of the learnings that I took, especially from Safelite is that you just need to shut up and listen sometimes and see how the business and the team got to the way that they're doing things. There's always a reason for it, good, better, and different, and to go in and assume that you know better is not the right answer. I've taken that to Quantum, which is let's just sit back and ask some questions and learn and take a lot of notes. Luckily I report to a leader who is very supportive of that idea.

Adam Miller:

My first 90 days is supposed to be nothing but listening or asking questions. Yeah. That's a great place to be, I'm not being tasked with just do the things, build the process right away. Because that doesn't make sense. I've tried to do that. Nobody likes the outcome. I think that's my biggest lesson learned is just sit back, serve, ask, and listen along the way, because something that worked at your last company is never going to work again, identically. It's just not going to do the same thing. It's always a different skillset, different population, different players, different stakeholders, so that's the big one.

Debbie Tuel:

We're three weeks in, you said you're going to listen for 90 days, but what are maybe those one or two things that you've already recognized and said, okay, I know that this is something that's going to be a top priority for me as I take a look into that people process change?

Adam Miller:

Yeah. I think the big one and luckily all of the recruiters and coordinators and everybody in the team so far, seems aligned to this is that while everybody's doing things similarly, there is no SOP or SLA or process map even. That's, again, not a bad thing, just small company, you don't necessarily need that. But when you start to add double digits in your team, you probably need that after a certain point. What that leads to is, it's hard to hold your hiring managers and your internal clients accountable. If you're not being held to the same standard and you're not following your own rigid process, you have to deliver on what you're promising so that they're being bound to the same terms. That's the big one for me, is how do we scope out a process that even if it's just for the next year is at least on paper and we can abide by it so we can measure success?

Debbie Tuel:

Yeah. Then it gives you the room to iterate on it and say, okay, well this is working or this isn't working. And without those SLAs, without that baseline, you can't really identify outside of gut, but to have some data backed, it gives you that ability to really shift based on data and goes back to the conversation we had earlier. Being able to bring that business case back relies on the data that you have so you've got to start there. All right, Adam, then we are going to go ahead and wrap up with our standard podcast questions, it's our rapid fire right at the very end. What is the one book or podcast that you would recommend from this past year that's been most beneficial in either personal or a business?

Adam Miller:

Ooh, I'm sorry that I'm not going to name this podcast, that would sound really cliche.

Debbie Tuel:

It would.

Adam Miller:

My number one podcast I would say is, this is going to sound funny, but Art of Manliness. It's something that I've been listening to on and off for the last eight years. But really it's about being a renaissance person. My girlfriend listens to it with me every morning as I'm getting ready for the day. It'll talk about anything from exercise and diet habits, to how to be a more effective communicator in the workplace, to how to consider others. It's literally the most well rounded set of knowledge that's obscure that you would never seek out, but you're happy that you listen to it at the end of the day.

Debbie Tuel:

All right. I am a podcast junkie. I think I'm going to have to go ahead and subscribe and get on that one. Who is the one person that you think everyone should follow in talent acquisition? Whether a practitioner, just somebody that you've learned a lot from.

Adam Miller:

This is not going to be a serious play, but I love me some Adam Kopiak. I love him with all that I am.

Debbie Tuel:

Shout out to Adam. The Adam is sharing some love with the other Adams.

Adam Miller:

His constant trolling of the hiring process is my favorite thing on earth.

Debbie Tuel:

You have to have a little humor in your day, so those are oftentimes the best follows. I agree. What is the next cool piece of tech that you're excited for in talent acquisition?

Adam Miller:

Ooh, I'm really excited for where the whole AI chat, text engagement and scheduling platforms are going. I know Paradox is obviously a market leader in that space, but everybody is doing some iteration of it at this point, even ATSs and sites are loading on their own versions. That has such an opportunity to just streamline how we all live and work every day without having to buy 12 different vendors worth of bolt-ons.

Debbie Tuel:

Agreed. Shout out to Paradox, good friends of ours over here. We love those guys. Adam, if people want to know more about you, how can they find you?

Adam Miller:

I think LinkedIn is the only thing left at this point. I was that guy that when the pandemic went crazy, I deleted all my social media, which is the most non-millennial thing in the world to do, but I absolutely did it and I'm better for it. It's linkedin.com/in/adamsilasmiller and I say Silas because Adam Miller is the most common name ever.

Debbie Tuel:

I was going to say, there's a lot of Adam Miller, so make sure you get that Silas in there. You could also just Google Adam Miller, Quantum Health, it will probably find you that way on LinkedIn as well. Adam, thank you so much for joining us today and sharing everything that you've learned in how to scale teams, what you would do differently, what you're working on today. We always love getting to the nuts and the bolts of what practitioners are seeing and how they're adapting and how they're building those business cases for change internally. Thank you so much for joining us.

Adam Miller:

Absolutely. Thanks for having me.

Debbie Tuel:

Have a great day.

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